Category: Nancy Kelley

Nancy Kelley

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Interview with Jessica Parker for the BBC. Link below.

Nancy Kelley May 2021

The interview took place after one of the fourteen founders of Stonewall, Matthew Parris, criticised the organisation. He is not along among the founders but joins Simon Fanshawe who also believes the former gay lobby group has lost its way. Here is why Parris is disillusioned. 👇

Kelley is dismissive of his concerns.

Section 28

It is worth remembering that Stonewall was formed to defend Gay rights during the era of Section 28. This piece of legislation was introduced under Margaret Thatcher’s government with the intention of stopping the “promotion” of homosexuality. The legislation was repealed in the year 2000, in Scotland, and in 2003 in England and Wales. This has been very hard to live down for the Conservative party and is partly explains why there has been a slow response to the promotion of Gender Identity Ideology in schools. To neophytes it looks as if any opposition is akin to eighties style homophobia. In reality, the idea gender non-conforming children should be medicalised, via puberty blockers, followed by cross sex hormones, disproportionately affects proto-gay kids. These are the statistics on referrals to the U.K. Gender Clinic. Natal females are in blue, males in orange.

Arcus Foundation

After the repeal of section 28, Stonewall still had work to do, to provide legal protection for gay couples. In 2004 legislation was passed to enable gay couples to enter a Civil Partnership; prior to this gay couples could find themselves unable to inherit their husband, or wife’s, assets or even to be in charge of funeral arrangements.. In 2010 the Equality Act was passed; which made sexual orientation a legally, protected characteristic. Finally in March 2014 the same sex marriage act passed into law. Stonewall found itself with less headline grabbing work to do. In 2015 the gay rights charity accepted $100,000 from the Arcus Foundation, money which was conditional on Stonewall adding the T to LGB.

You can read more about the Arcus Foundation here;

ARCUS FOUNDATION GRANTS

So, when Nancy Kelley became CEO, of Stonewall, it was a very different organisation to the one her predecessor, Ruth Hunt, inherited.

Free Speech

Stonewall now finds itself having the defend the idea that Lesbians have a penis and it is no longer “SEXual orientation” but “same gender attraction”. Unsurprisingly many people oppose this and after trying to impose a blanket ban, arguing for #NoDebate, on discussing Gender Identity Ideology, Stonewall now find themselves opposed by many who would have been its natural supporters.

Stonewall now find themselves opposing the Equality and Human Rights Commission who, somewhat belatedly, came out in favour of women’s right to discuss this issue. (The previous Chair of the EHRC, David Isaacs, came via Stonewall, which may have coloured his views).

Stonewall were clearly rattled by the intervention of the EHRC, who also cautioned the Scottish government about their plan to allow “self-identification” as the sex you wish you were. This was a provocation too far, for the Trans Lobby group, who appealed to the United Nations to intervene. The EHRC is accredited, as a Human Rights organisation, by the United Nations and, it seems, Stonewall wished to see this removed.

Kelley’s response to the EHRC is displayed below:

Writing this in the wake of Salman Rushdie’s stabbing gives new urgency on the right to defend free speech. 👇

Stonewall Law

Nancy denies that Stonewall are giving bad advice to the members of its protection racket, oops, Diversity Schemes.

The new spin from Stonewall when they are caught lying about the law.

Here is what Akua Reindorf said in the above mentioned report: “the law as Stonewall would prefer it to be rather than the law as it is”.

Unrepentant Nancy?

The attempt to label womens rights campaigners as akin to one of the most egregious forms of racism is rather too common in Trans Supremacist circles.

It is no accident. Accusations of “transphobia” have been denuded of their power, likely through their over abundant use, hence the escalation. Here is Judith Butler comparing us to fascists. 😳

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Nancy Kelley is what I call a Vichy Feminist. How any self-respecting Lesbian could be the midwife for this regressive, mysogynistic, lesbian hating ideology is beyond my underst££ding.

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Nancy Kelley: Woman’s Hour

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As promised this is a record of Nancy Kelley’s interview with Emma Barnett. You can listen to it here:

Nancy Kelley

Here is a transcript.

Nancy Kelley WH interview 18th Nov 2021

The interview opens with a soft question about why Kelley wanted to become the CEO for Stonewall to which Nancy gives a predictable answer about wanting to “give back”.  During the course of the interview we learn that Nancy is in a fifteen year marriage, to an American woman . They then covers a Lesbian couple and their fight to get access to in vitro-fertilisation.  Then the interviewer, Emma Barnett dives in to the most controversial topic. 

Nancy’s agrees that the BBC needs to be seen to be impartial but this part of the answer might be called disingenuous /damage limitation give Stonewall, at this time was haemorrhaging participants in its various, money making schemes. 👇

Barnett is not letting Kelley get away with that and responds “But, the sense where you said the BBC doesn’t agree with itself, well it obviously did, it pulled out”. She then goes on to make a really good point that all these organisations are actually paying money to a lobby group, to be lobbied. It is worth a reminder, at this stage, of how Ruth Hunt described these schemes. It was not flattering to the participants, it made them look rather gullible.

Nancy plays down the role of Stonewall schemes explaining that they have one strand of work to help firms become more “inclusive” (She uses this word repeatedly and I would have preferred for her to be pushed on what this means. To me, now, it means make sure men can invade female spaces). Then they have a “completely separate” team the lobby politicians and work with the media. Barnett presses her on this and Kelley conceded the two teams nevertheless have the same goals.

Next Kelley is tackled on the detail of the Workplace Equality Scheme and, in particular that Stonewall evaluate submissions from the scheme participants and suggest ways they can get an improved score. Following Stonewall “suggestions” helps get your company higher up the rankings and there will be entire teams who are set a performance objective to complete for an improved place on the Workplace Equality Index.

Nancy is also keen to emphasise that membership doesn’t compromise editorial integrity, at the BBC, which stretches credulity to breaking point. Kelley denies that the BBC is aggressively pro-trans rights and, in fact, argues it tips the other way. Nancy maintains their role is only advisory and they do not have control over what an organisation does. Furthermore she says she only wishes she had more influence.

Stonewall and the Scottish Government.

Next Barnett tackles Kelley about a leaked Freedom of information request, that illustrates how Stonewall encouraged the Scottish government to drop the word “Mother” from its maternity leave policy. Kelley insists that she doesn’t want the word “mother” eradicated, as a mum herself. She claims the FOI document is historic and Stonewall give a range of advice leaving it up to their scheme members to decide the course of action.

Barnett points out that the document is only two years old and that Stonewall did push to remove “all gendered language” from the Maternity policy and raises this with Kelley:

Next Nancy denies that Stonewall have an interest in changing language and illustrates this beautifully by talking about “cis” and “trans”. This was in response to a direct question about whether she believes people can change their biological sex. She avoids saying no or yes by talking about changing sex characteristics and claiming that everyone knows that “trans” bodies and “cis” bodies are different.

Sexual Racists.

Next Kelley is asked about Stonewall’s acceptance of male lesbians or “transbian’s” or females who identify as gay men. This section covers what Nancy had to say about lesbians who exclude males from their dating pools. Nancy lumps a belief in biological sex, women’s rights to exclude men from our spaces and Lesbians refusal of “lady penis” is on a par with anti-semitism”. 👇

This speaks to the right of lesbians to exclude men from their dating pools and has particular impact on dating apps and attempts to have Lesbian only events. This is no longer a hypothetical scenario: Tasmania a Lesbian groups has recently been told their women only, Lesbian nights are now illegal.

Nancy alleges that she was not talking about dating practices and that her wording was rather clumsy. This would be believable we’re it not for the fact that numerous trans-activists have used exactly the same argument.

Barnett then digs up another quote from Nancy :

Then we get onto Kelley’s dating preferences. A moot point because she is safely married. She claims to respect either people’s dating preferences and that she is “trans-inclusive”. Pretty confident this is a big fat lie and she knows she won’t have to walk the walk. This is the most despicable betrayal of Lesbians, especially newly out, young Lesbians.

Nancy slips in a “trans women are women” during this spiel and Barnett asks her if she is talking metaphorically. Kelley simply answers “literally”.

There follows a brief reference to the protection of Gender Critical beliefs which is clearly about the Forstater case but Barnett does not name it. Nancy ties herself in knots acknowledging that “Gender Critical” beliefs may be protected but there are limitations in how you express them. What Kelly would like is to create a world where you are allowed to think these things but you should not verbalise them.

Is JK Rowling a transphobe?

This section interrogates Kelley’s views on the world famous author. She tries to duck the question but ends up going round in circles about whether Rowling is a “transphobe” but, in the end, claiming that she had a large platform and had said things that had “caused harm” to trans people. Barnett does quite a good job in this section as she pushes Kelley to explain what she has said that was “transphobic”. Kelley pretty much ends up agreeing that an individual woman has the right to a single sex service if she has been raped or suffered domestic violence but still implies there is something wrong with saying this in the public square. I think she skewers Nancy in this bit and she does sound a bit petulant in places.

Kathleen Stock

This section was less satisfactory. Nancy manages to come across as reasonable and she expresses empathy for what Kathleen went throug, but, there are some very big buts. Barnett seems unwilling to raise the fact that Kathleen is a Lesbian, who Stonewall should protect. I think this made this section weaker than it should be. Stonewall’s CEO should have asked why they were silent on the harassment of a Lesbian.

Kelley affects to know little about the Stock case and falls back on the idea that Universities are responsible for adjudicating on staff issues. The Stonewall model seems to be built on encouraging their clients to over-extend/break the law and then running away when they’re are consequences. Any organisation still paying to be in this protectionless, protection racket needs to get a new head of Human Resources.

The interview ends with some general talk about how Stonewall are working to protect LGBTQ+ kids in school.

Nolan Podcast

Barnett ends the interview but added a couple of postscripts. Confirmation that Stonewall had attempted to get the word “mother” dropped from a maternity leave policy. The Scottish government claim they have not removed the word. Finally a, dignified, “no comment” from the Rowling team.

This piece is part of a series on Nancy Kelley’s public utterances. There’s not as much in the public domain as there is on Ruth Hunt. You can find the Nancy Kelly series and Ruth Hunt, former CEO, below.

Nancy Kelley

Ruth Hunt

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Nancy Kelley & Al Jazeera Part 2.

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Part one set the scene for this interview giving the background of the interviewer and the participants.

Nancy Kelley & Al Jazeera Part 1

After a long preamble, replete with many false/exaggerated claims (debunked in part one) Lamont goes in 👇

He addresses the question to trans activist, Christine Burns, who feigns bafflement and, after a little chuckle, claims it’s a mystery.

What Burns omits is the over-reach of trans-activists who right around this time were making ever more extreme demands. The specific issue that woke a lot of women up, especially lesbians, was the campaign to de-medicalise ”transition” and allow bearded, penis-wielders, to self-identify as women.

Burn’s then outlines how much progress had been made in protecting ”trans” rights including their own role in getting the Gender Recognition Act passed, in 2004.

Nancy Kelley then jumps in to make somewhat contentious claims about public acceptance of ”trans” people. She is right that there was a widespread acceptance of people we used to call ”transsexuals”. If they thought about the issue at all, people assumed we were talking about, a tiny number of, people who were post-operative. When it is explained that many/most retain their penis and are heterosexual there are significant qualifiers to that “acceptance”. Nancy also implies it is a matter of education.

Back to Burns to explain why our media are so out of step with views Kelley claims are held by the majority of the British public.

In reality most people had no idea activists were involved in a social engineering project; to reorganise society on the basis of ”gender identity” and ride roughshod over women’s sex based rights. Once that became clear opposition began to mobilise.

Lamont then reads, in a skeptical tone, some of the U.K headlines. They all seem rooted in reality to me 👇

Nancy wades in about the proliferation of articles in the media. Nancy thinks it’s too much and would really rather it wasn’t covered. Of course she does, thats the advice from the Denton’s document.

Lamont then asks Burns why so many of the criticisms come from women who ”identify as feminists”.

Burns is having none of it and invents a complete fiction that second wave feminists were working with men, like Burns, because we had common interests. 🤷‍♀️

Then Burn’s pivots to ”White Supremacists” . Bit of a leap there Christine, love. 👇

After he takes it upon himself to define feminism he then advances the argument that these feminists, many of whom are Lesbian, are trying to separate the T from LGB so that the rights of the other letters can be attacked.

The interviewer pushes back, a little bit, to ask Burns for his thoughts on ”Terfs”. [BTW No self-respecting woman, let alone a “Terf” accepts the appellation “cisgender”. ]

Christine, like sexist men from the beginning of time, thinks we have misunderstood.

LGB Alliance

Lamont now turns to Nancy:

Nancy doesn’t dare, outright, deny this.

Next Nancy, conveniently, overlooks that even Stonewall didn’t include advocacy for ”trans” rights until 2015.

It’s women’s rights, stupid!

The interviewer is from the United States and, to give him credit, he does not assume U.K politics is a mirror of the political landscape of our American cousins. However after raising the source of the ”transphobia” on Terf Island (It’s women’s rights, stupid) he immediately pivots to how dangerous it is to be ”transgender”.

Burn’s arguments are all about the difficulty of looking like a man and being unable to use female changing rooms. Worrying about being recognised as a man when going to get a pint of milk. This, right there, tells you he has no idea of what it means to be a woman. Men who identify as women are well on their way to having more rights than actual women. That’s male privilege Christine.

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Nancy Kelley & Al Jazeera Part 1

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As part of my series on Nancy Kelley I found this astonishing interview on Al Jazeera: a media outlet partially funded by the government of Quatar. You can watch it at the link below: 👇

Nancy Kelley on Al Jazeera

YouTube add a note to the Al Jazeera YouTube channel to highlight their financial backers.

Gay Rights in Qatar

A reminder of the state of gay rights in Qatar. 👇 The punishment for homosexuality is death.

The alleged context for the interview.

The segment focus is on the rising ”transphobia” in the U.K. To explore the issue Christine Burns, “trans-identified” male and Nancy Kelley are invited to a discussion. In truth Burns is given much more air time than Kelley. Burns is a key trans-activist (TRA) in the U.K. Nancy Kelley is the CEO of controversial, lobby group Stonewall. You will also notice the interview takes place against a background draped in the transgender flag.

The presenter is Mark Lamont Hill, a former journalist with CNN who was, reportedly, let go for his views on the Israeli-Palestine conflict. He is also a Professor of Media Studies.

Lamont Hill introduces the segment by claiming that Hate Crimes against trans people are rising, there is hostile media coverage and he singles out the former Prime Minister, Boris Johnson, for failing to introduce a ban on ”Conversion Therapy”.

Mark Lamont

Hate Crime: The Facts.

These are the numbers charged with a hate crime defined as ”transphobic”. As you can see it was 49.

Its important to note that misogyny is not considered a hate crime so offences motivated by animus, toward the female sex, is not monitored. If we consider rape /domestic violence as a proxy for misogyny the statistics below are for one quarter of the year. The statistics are taken from the Crown Prosecution Service.

Media Coverage

Complaints are made about the volume of media coverage with little attempt to explain why this became a contested area in 2017. Neither Nancy or Burns explain that Stonewall only began to campaign on “Transgender” issues in 2015 and this has been accompanied by an escalation in demands. TRAs openly began to demand that any man could ”self–identify” as a woman and campaigned vociferously for access to female only spaces. Here is Stonewall’s open statement that they wish to see the end of single sex spaces. This 👇 is a blatant attack on women’s rights to dignity, privacy and, crucially, safety,

In truth papers like the Guardian, Independent, Pink News and free paper, Metro, are cheerleaders for the Transgender Lobby. The Guardian in particular, much to the dismay of this erstwhile reader. I wrote about the Guardian links to lobby groups here:

Why are the Guardian suddenly so woeful on women’s rights?

Conversion Therapy

The demand to ban conversion therapy includes both gay conversion therapy and ”gender identity” . The main place where gay conversion therapy takes place, in the United Kingdom, is at U.K gender clinics. These are the statistics for referrals to the Tavisticock, looking at sexual orientation.

Here is a reminder of what Professor Villain had to say about this. He is one of a growing number of experts raising the issue of Gay Conversion Therapy in relation to Gender Clinics.

Including ”gender identity” in the bill would hamper therapeutic approaches to treat “gender dysphoria”. This context it important but the audience will gain no understanding of this from the interview.

Framing the question

After this disingenuous framing the interviewer turns to his guests. At least he doesn’t project a U.S perspective onto the U.K political context by assuming we are right wing, Evangelical Christians. 👇. He does recognises the concern’s raised about women’s rights before pivoting to the vulnerable, transgender people. An editorial decision was taken to invite a trans-identified male and Nancy Kelley on the show, even though they agree with one another. Noticeably they failed to invite anyone with an opposing viewpoint.

Christine Burns

Burns is a trans activist who appears here with the book Trans Britain; which they edited, in the background as well as the M.B.E they were awarded.

Burns is asked to define ”trans” and ”cis” . I won’t insult your intelligence by repeating the usual verbiage.

Lamont now references a Council of Europe report which conflates the attacks on gay rights and reproductive freedom in Hungary and Poland with UK feminists opposed to Gender Identity Ideology. I covered in this blog, below 👇. In brief they completely mis-characterise the debate we are having in the U.K, quoting the controversial lobby group, Mermaids amongst others. You can read more about this here: 👇. Short read: Blatant propaganda.

Council of Europe: Moral Panic

Burns, is asked to explain why if has got so bad for ”trans” people in the U.K. Burns professes bafflement and, claims everything was going in the right direction up until 2017 and implies this came out of nowhere. “It’s a mystery“ says Burns.

Burns fails to mention that people were unaware of what was happening in our schools, prisons, NHS wards and all our major institutions because it was a deliberate strategy. As set out in the Denton’s document, a guide to embedding Gender Identity Ideology in law and in life.

I wrote about the Denton’s document here 👇

That Denton’s Document

Of course, Burns doesn’t mention the campaign to let any man self-id as a woman; putting male rapists in female prisons; the sterilisation of children and the other horrors, which galvanised women and generated this backlash. Here’s a clip from a chapter in Burn’s own book illustrating Burn’s complicity.

The mendacity is strong with this one. Burns was one of the architects of the Gender Recognition Act , which set the stage for this debacle, and proudly boasts of it in this interview.

I will cover the details of the interview in part 2.

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Nancy Kelley: Transition

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Ever the optimist that a post Stonewall world may be on the horizon I want to get on record the role its current CEO has played in besmirching the reputation of a once great organisation. I will begin with this interview, from two years ago, which she did with Linda Riley of Diva Magazine.

You can watch the interview here: 👇

Nancy Kelley: Interview

For those of you unaware, Riley has somewhat of a reputation herself as covered by Private Eye. None of these revelations concerned Dawn Butler, who appointed Riley as LGBT advisor to Labour.

The interview took place four weeks into Kelley’s tenure as CEO of Stonewall and Riley selected questions, put to her from Diva readers.

One of the earlier questions related to a question on whether Kelley had intended criticism of her predecessor, Ruth Hunt, in a Guardian interview. She had stated Stonewall would no longer insist everyone needed agree with their stance on “trans” rights. I am confident that this was the interview in question and the comment Riley singles out for questions is linked below: 👇

Nancy Kelley

Kelley is keen to dispel any notion that she is being critical of her predecessor:

She proceeds to outline her own position which reflects the Stonewall dogma, right down to forgetting about ”trans” men, I might add.

She, then, professes to accept that not all feminists will be intersectional and it is these people she would like to reach. It all started so reasonably.

The next question asks if she can elaborate about her impressions on taking up the role and the thing that surprised her the most. Her answer is very revealing and somewhat ironic at this point; as we watching Stonewall’s influence drain away.

Later she follows up the issue of Stonewall’s influence, revealing that they are acfively lobbying the NHS over healthcare issues and why they are uniquely placed to be successful; because of the high number of NHS trusts in their protection racket, oops, sorry, I mean their Diversity Champions scheme.

Asked to let the audience know what she is currently up to she says the quiet bit out loud about her liaison with Stella Creasy and the attempt to class misogyny as a hate crime. Of course they are trying to make sure it covers trans-identified males; no doubt making some litigious trans activist salivate over the prospect of the maximum validation attainable in prosecuting a woman for the crime of misogyny against a “transgender woman”

She also reveals she has been doing a bit of Northern outreach to address concerns they are too London centric. This would be the same Andy Burnham who has remained studiously silent about the aggressive “trans” (men’s) rights activists in his city.

Sexual Racists

Nancy’s conciliatory tone didn’t last as illustrated in a superb article by Jo Bartosch.

Sexual Racists

The BBC finally covered some research about Lesbians being pressured to have sex with trans-identified males.

Nancy responded with an astonishing outburst about Lesbians who are ”gender critical”. i.e. think being a Lesbian means you can refuse to date men who identify as Lesbians (Nancy, is not vulnerable herself, as she is in a long term partnership with an American woman).

It then emerged that Stonewall had attempted to suppress the report on Lesbians being sexually harassed.

Five Year Plan.

I was disappointed that Nancy didn’t acknowledge Stonewall’s intention to indulge in a bit of historical revisionism about the riots which inspired their name. Pretending the entire Gay rights movement was kickstarted by ”Transgender Women” and ignoring the role of Lesbians and Gay men would have made even Stalin blush. This 👇is abject capitulation from a once proud organisation. She is bending the knee to a Men’s, sexual, rights movement and throwing the gay community, particularly, Lesbian under the “transgender” train.

Finally!

Lest Kelley tries to airbrush herself out of the trans debacle and the fall of Stonewall she condemned herself with this statement.

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